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Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2016 10:25 am

bethlehempardView user's profile






Joined: 28 Sep 2011
Posts: 2131







CBS sports ranks Lafayette No. 342 of 351. Ahead of Grambling, Florida A&M, Alabama A&M, Delaware State, CCSU, Central Arkansas, Savannah State, AR-Pine Bluff and Chicago State.
Behind .... well behind everybody else. Including my new favorite, Incarnate Word. Go Cardinals!

http://www.cbssports.com/college-...-351-college-basketball-rankings/

342. Lafayette
A six-win team a season ago, I'm thinking the Leopards can be better, but need to see them prove it. Man, it gets depressing once this list hits the 340s. Dark, really.

Yeah. Really!


Last edited by bethlehempard on Wed Oct 19, 2016 1:11 pm; edited 3 times in total

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Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2016 12:37 pm

pardfanView user's profile






Joined: 07 Sep 2014
Posts: 405







Things have never been worse when it comes to Lafayette athletics.  It tarnishes the College's reputation;  I'm certain of that.

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Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2016 12:49 pm

KpardView user's profile






Joined: 07 Nov 2011
Posts: 1272


Location: Bethlehem





Nowhere to go but up! Rolling Eyes
_________________
GO PARDS!

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Posted: Thu Oct 20, 2016 6:12 am

CHIP72View user's profile






Joined: 13 Sep 2014
Posts: 81


Location: Silver Spring, MD





It's an opportunity to switch the discussion from "Frank Tavani has been at Lafayette too long and needs to go" to "Fran O'Hanlon has been at Lafayette too long and needs to go".

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Posted: Thu Oct 20, 2016 6:07 pm

bethlehempardView user's profile






Joined: 28 Sep 2011
Posts: 2131







Picked ninth in the PL:

http://collegebasketball.nbcsport...looks-to-end-unpredictable-trend/

These predictions are mostly based on last year. Maybe there will be a big improvement. There is only so much Nick can do despite his will and talent.

A note on Michael Hoffman's new team:

http://www.themonitor.com/sports/...-8916-11e6-8f2d-ef052e36179e.html

MBB is getting close to two decades without consecutive winning seasons.
1998-99
1999-00

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Posted: Thu Oct 20, 2016 7:16 pm

pardfanView user's profile






Joined: 07 Sep 2014
Posts: 405







CHIP72 wrote:
It's an opportunity to switch the discussion from "Frank Tavani has been at Lafayette too long and needs to go" to "Fran O'Hanlon has been at Lafayette too long and needs to go".


I don't think we REALLY have the money necessary to clean house and wind up with coaches and an AD capable of competing IN THIS LEAGUE in the major sports.  We're stuck with these guys.

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Posted: Thu Oct 20, 2016 9:06 pm

ed65View user's profile






Joined: 04 Sep 2013
Posts: 889


Location: New York City





pardfan wrote:
CHIP72 wrote:
It's an opportunity to switch the discussion from "Frank Tavani has been at Lafayette too long and needs to go" to "Fran O'Hanlon has been at Lafayette too long and needs to go".


I don't think we REALLY have the money necessary to clean house and wind up with coaches and an AD capable of competing IN THIS LEAGUE in the major sports. We're stuck with these guys.


Totally disagree.  You must have inside information.

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Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2016 11:44 am

SixtyEighterView user's profile






Joined: 28 Oct 2013
Posts: 504







I have more faith that Fran can turn his team around than I do that Tavani can.Tavani is in denial.He believes the team can win if only pushed and guided.

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Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:09 pm

LC FanView user's profile






Joined: 03 Oct 2007
Posts: 137







That's like comparing an onion with a scallion. They both stink.

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Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:36 pm

bethlehempardView user's profile






Joined: 28 Sep 2011
Posts: 2131







Another basement prediction:

http://www.midmajormadness.com/20...nkings-lehigh-bucknell-holy-cross

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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 6:42 am

CHIP72View user's profile






Joined: 13 Sep 2014
Posts: 81


Location: Silver Spring, MD





My 2 cents about Fran O'Hanlon (who I've always liked) is that he did a really good job for about his first decade or so on College Hill, with the high point obviously being those back-to-back NCAA Tournament appearances in 1999 and 2000.  But since about the mid-2000s, O'Hanlon's teams have either achieved as expected or underachieved, increasingly often the latter; it was the opposite prior to that.  Even two years ago (2014-2015), the Leopards were expected to win the Patriot League but only went 9-9 in league play in the regular season before getting on a hot streak in the PL Tournament to earn the NCAA Tournament berth and (IMO) salvage what had been a disappointing season.  It was no surprise Lafayette struggled last year because they had a young team; the disappointing thing was just how poor the Leopards were.

Fran O'Hanlon did a fine job at Lafayette for a few years, and all Leopards fans should appreciate where he took Lafayette basketball early on in his tenure.  But much like Frank Tavani (who also did a good job his first few seasons on College Hill), O'Hanlon has probably overstayed his welcome by a few years.

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Posted: Sun Oct 23, 2016 6:14 am

seenalotView user's profile






Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 1424







Coaching is a tough profession.  Like being CEO.  But you can not keep losing and losing and losing - and simply point to a few good years, being a decent guy and running a "clean and respectable program" ANYWHERE else on this or any other planet and expect to keep coming back.  Those are table stakes - except for some unknown reason we can not figure that out....

So we have two head coaches and an AD who seemingly have jobs for life.  Would be like the CEO of a major retail operation who had no plan for the web or on line sales......nah, who needs to change with the times.  Lets keep getting big offensive lineman who can not move, coaches without an iota of imagination or the ability to coach them up, skinning kids who can shoot but not plan defense or rebound and expect success. Carney had it right, this is moronic and I am done being a dope that supports it.

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Posted: Sun Oct 23, 2016 10:15 am

AndyView user's profile






Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 6151







CHIP72 wrote:
My 2 cents about Fran O'Hanlon (who I've always liked) is that he did a really good job for about his first decade or so on College Hill, with the high point obviously being those back-to-back NCAA Tournament appearances in 1999 and 2000. But since about the mid-2000s, O'Hanlon's teams have either achieved as expected or underachieved, increasingly often the latter; it was the opposite prior to that. Even two years ago (2014-2015), the Leopards were expected to win the Patriot League but only went 9-9 in league play in the regular season before getting on a hot streak in the PL Tournament to earn the NCAA Tournament berth and (IMO) salvage what had been a disappointing season. It was no surprise Lafayette struggled last year because they had a young team; the disappointing thing was just how poor the Leopards were.

Fran O'Hanlon did a fine job at Lafayette for a few years, and all Leopards fans should appreciate where he took Lafayette basketball early on in his tenure. But much like Frank Tavani (who also did a good job his first few seasons on College Hill), O'Hanlon has probably overstayed his welcome by a few years.


Gee, chip, do think playing in a scholarship league w/out scholarships had anything to do with LC basketball performance?  Fran's first schol class(full recruiting cycle) was 2007,  3 per year.  Since 2009 he's been in the finals 4 times and semis once. His championship is 2 years old, long enough for you to diminish it, I guess.  Clearly, when Fran has had a level playing field (before and with scholarships) he's had terrific tournament success, which is what I value.

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Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2016 11:37 am

CHIP72View user's profile






Joined: 13 Sep 2014
Posts: 81


Location: Silver Spring, MD





Andy wrote:
CHIP72 wrote:
My 2 cents about Fran O'Hanlon (who I've always liked) is that he did a really good job for about his first decade or so on College Hill, with the high point obviously being those back-to-back NCAA Tournament appearances in 1999 and 2000. But since about the mid-2000s, O'Hanlon's teams have either achieved as expected or underachieved, increasingly often the latter; it was the opposite prior to that. Even two years ago (2014-2015), the Leopards were expected to win the Patriot League but only went 9-9 in league play in the regular season before getting on a hot streak in the PL Tournament to earn the NCAA Tournament berth and (IMO) salvage what had been a disappointing season. It was no surprise Lafayette struggled last year because they had a young team; the disappointing thing was just how poor the Leopards were.

Fran O'Hanlon did a fine job at Lafayette for a few years, and all Leopards fans should appreciate where he took Lafayette basketball early on in his tenure. But much like Frank Tavani (who also did a good job his first few seasons on College Hill), O'Hanlon has probably overstayed his welcome by a few years.


Gee, chip, do think playing in a scholarship league w/out scholarships had anything to do with LC basketball performance? Fran's first schol class(full recruiting cycle) was 2007, 3 per year. Since 2009 he's been in the finals 4 times and semis once. His championship is 2 years old, long enough for you to diminish it, I guess. Clearly, when Fran has had a level playing field (before and with scholarships) he's had terrific tournament success, which is what I value.


If you are going to base a team's success on what it does in a 3 or 4 game postseason tournament, be my guest.  However, like most logical people, I'm going to base my assessment of Lafayette basketball - and every other college basketball team I follow - on what they do for the entire season.  And Lafayette's regular season results have generally been lacking for most of the last decade, relative to reasonable preseason expectations.  They've finished above .500 in Patriot League play three times (if one includes PL Tournament games; excluding those games the number of occurrences drops to twice) and above 3rd place in the Patriot League once since 2003-04.

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Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2016 12:42 pm

AndyView user's profile






Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 6151







CHIP72 wrote:
Andy wrote:
CHIP72 wrote:
My 2 cents about Fran O'Hanlon (who I've always liked) is that he did a really good job for about his first decade or so on College Hill, with the high point obviously being those back-to-back NCAA Tournament appearances in 1999 and 2000. But since about the mid-2000s, O'Hanlon's teams have either achieved as expected or underachieved, increasingly often the latter; it was the opposite prior to that. Even two years ago (2014-2015), the Leopards were expected to win the Patriot League but only went 9-9 in league play in the regular season before getting on a hot streak in the PL Tournament to earn the NCAA Tournament berth and (IMO) salvage what had been a disappointing season. It was no surprise Lafayette struggled last year because they had a young team; the disappointing thing was just how poor the Leopards were.

Fran O'Hanlon did a fine job at Lafayette for a few years, and all Leopards fans should appreciate where he took Lafayette basketball early on in his tenure. But much like Frank Tavani (who also did a good job his first few seasons on College Hill), O'Hanlon has probably overstayed his welcome by a few years.


Gee, chip, do think playing in a scholarship league w/out scholarships had anything to do with LC basketball performance? Fran's first schol class(full recruiting cycle) was 2007, 3 per year. Since 2009 he's been in the finals 4 times and semis once. His championship is 2 years old, long enough for you to diminish it, I guess. Clearly, when Fran has had a level playing field (before and with scholarships) he's had terrific tournament success, which is what I value.


If you are going to base a team's success on what it does in a 3 or 4 game postseason tournament, be my guest. However, like most logical people, I'm going to base my assessment of Lafayette basketball - and every other college basketball team I follow - on what they do for the entire season. And Lafayette's regular season results have generally been lacking for most of the last decade, relative to reasonable preseason expectations. They've finished above .500 in Patriot League play three times (if one includes PL Tournament games; excluding those games the number of occurrences drops to twice) and above 3rd place in the Patriot League once since 2003-04.


Like anyone with any sense, I believe that the goal in NCAA basketball is to get to the Big Dance. The coach who has his team peaking at tournament time is the one with the best chance of fulfilling his kids' dream.  Fran is a master at this.

Once again chipster you cite LC basketball stats from 2003 forward w/out referencing the fact that Fran was forced to play w/out scholarships in a scholarship league and, of course, you give no recognition to 4 trips to the league final in 6 years. Amazing! Give Brett Reed a hug for me, will ya.

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Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2016 5:02 pm

kramerView user's profile






Joined: 27 Nov 2012
Posts: 32


Location: Chalfont, PA





Wow, it's pretty negative around here.  Looking forward to the season starting, and seeing how Lehigh and Lafayette stock up against each other.  Should be fun (at least in Bethlehem).

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Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2016 5:16 pm

bethlehempardView user's profile






Joined: 28 Sep 2011
Posts: 2131







It hasn't been much fun from my vantage point in Bethlehem. We will see how Kempton does.

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Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2016 7:38 pm

AndyView user's profile






Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 6151







Two seasons away from the 20 win championship season, we've had an almost complete roster turnover. Looks like 11 fr and sophs, with only 11 scholarship players total. Not expecting much, but will be fun to watch them develop and see what we've got.  And will enjoy watching a great competitor in Lindner.

Kempton was a legacy recruit, correct?  We failed to land ours - Chris McNaughton, a game changer of course.

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Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2016 7:54 pm

bison137View user's profile






Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 1378







Andy wrote:


Kempton was a legacy recruit, correct?



Kempton's dad played for Notre Dame.  Did he have a more distant relative who went to Lehigh?

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Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2016 8:56 pm

AndyView user's profile






Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 6151







bison137 wrote:
Andy wrote:


Kempton was a legacy recruit, correct?



Kempton's dad played for Notre Dame. Did he have a more distant relative who went to Lehigh?


Too many recruiting articles in the attic, along with the toys. Thanks for answering the question. A valid criticism of Fran though, not signing that special recruit who might give us a chance against the bigger boys. Kempton quoted that LUs win over Duke "put them on the map" for him. He was not highly recruited however. Great job by the LU assistant.

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