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Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2015 11:22 am

AndyView user's profile






Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 6047







Pard4Life wrote:
seenalot wrote:
Hopefully we develop a playbook for 5'8"-5'10" quick kids and not use them like they are 6'1" 210 pound running backs...


Exactly. That's Frank's #1 problem... he does not adjust the playbook for his personnel. Frank, if you are reading this, that's why you are called the "Frankosaurus"... you do not innovate on offense and stick to same ol', plodding tried and true methods. Sure, they work, but you have to have the right players. After all, Alabama runs our offense. And the Patriots used shades of it in the Super Bowl.


My problems with Coach T's offense over the years are more narrow in scope than what you guys describe. We can all recall a few crucial series at key points in games where we repeatedly ran up the middle. Also waiting until we got behind to open up. And, of course, the largely ineffective ride option that we overuse.

This year with Mrazek, et al, wide, the athleticism we've brought in at slot, Brown/Mayfield at TB, with Keller and the young athletic TEs, we certainly will have a ton of options. Looking for exciting rocket and bubble screens with these new guys. Not sure we've been all that effective with them since Brandon Stanford. Should be a handful to cover and fun to watch.

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Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2015 12:49 pm

seenalotView user's profile






Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 1424







What do you want to bet that EXACT same run up the middle or perhaps the equally ineffective the ride option call isn't the FIRST play called for 2015.....?  

Takers anyone?

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Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2015 2:47 pm

Franks TanksView user's profile






Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 3273







seenalot wrote:
What do you want to bet that EXACT same run up the middle or perhaps the equally ineffective the ride option call isn't the FIRST play called for 2015.....?

Takers anyone?


For those that are interested Ross's scouting profile is available on NFL.com.  It is rather positive overall, but the following line stood out to me.

"Difficult projection due to running-lane limitations with below-average blocking in front of him"

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2015/profiles/ross-scheuerman?id=2552639

Generally speaking I like Mickey.  I think some parts of his system are a bit questionable, such as sticking with the ride option although we don't seem to run it all that well.  I do think that Mickey is a quality game planer and in game play caller.  I do think Frank mucks up his play calls at times, and the periodic questionable play calls are not necessarily Mickey's fault.

We have to do better on the o-line. We've had talented and experienced players at several spots the last few years with continued poor results.  It is becoming like our basketball team's continued lack of athleticism.  We keep hoping for things to change, but all the same people stay in place and nothing does.

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Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2015 3:57 pm

RichHView user's profile






Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 1194







Andy,Guy over on Cross board posted that thete is a new PL allowing 5 WOs to receive need aid.Assume he means trie WOs not recruited PWOs. Neither I or 137 know anything about this.  Nothing in by laws. Any clue?

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Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:25 pm

Pard4LifeView user's profile






Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 3431







"Difficult projection due to running-lane limitations with below-average blocking in front of him"  ... is c2 the NFL's scouting publisher?

A weakness listed is a failure to dominate lower-level competition statistically... well, that is due to the above.  We saw what happened when he had one game with dominant blocking.  

OUR O-LINE MUST GET IT TOGETHER OR THERE IS NO WINNING SEASON AGAIN!
_________________
"Win, but be careful not to win too much. It's not healthy for our institution." - Lafayette Athletics Mission Statement

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Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2015 5:41 pm

AndyView user's profile






Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 6047







RichH wrote:
Andy,Guy over on Cross board posted that thete is a new PL allowing 5 WOs to receive need aid.Assume he means trie WOs not recruited PWOs. Neither I or 137 know anything about this. Nothing in by laws. Any clue?


I haven't heard rich, but I'm not an insider. That would be right up cr's alley.  Maybe flyfisher.   The issue is so cloudy anyway with "recruited"  "not-re ruited"  "walkon" "preferred walkon"  gives me a headache.  To meet all the regs it seems like a kid would have to be a student never talked to by a coach and who just asks to try out.

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Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2015 6:57 pm

RichHView user's profile






Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 1194







Thanks Andy. Hope flyfisher might know. I'll pop over and ask cr.

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Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2015 7:14 pm

AndyView user's profile






Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 6047







"Difficult projection due to running-lane limitations with below-average blocking in front of him"

Man, that gets to the heart of the matter, doesnt it?  Don't know what took us so long, but it seems as if the lack of athleticism was addressed with these incoming OL.  May the trend continue.

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Posted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 9:23 am

edge29View user's profile






Joined: 20 Nov 2010
Posts: 756







Franks Tanks wrote:


Generally speaking I like Mickey. I think some parts of his system are a bit questionable, such as sticking with the ride option although we don't seem to run it all that well. I do think that Mickey is a quality game planer and in game play caller. I do think Frank mucks up his play calls at times, and the periodic questionable play calls are not necessarily Mickey's fault.

We have to do better on the o-line. We've had talented and experienced players at several spots the last few years with continued poor results. It is becoming like our basketball team's continued lack of athleticism. We keep hoping for things to change, but all the same people stay in place and nothing does.


We've discussed this before and it does bring up a key point/challenge for Stan.  We run a ton of different sets, a multitude of formations, player combos, and then plays off them.  We run a lot of things on offense, but do we run any of them well?  What is our bread and butter play on O? Anyone?  

This is why I respect Colgate. You know what they're running, and you know what's coming at you.  Now try and stop it.  

We used to be this way when Hef. was o coordinator and Oline coach. When I played, we had FOUR running plays. FOUR!  It's much easier to teach and learn four plays and every possible blitz/combo scenario off them than what we currently run.  I believe it's another reason we have "no show" games. If a D throws something at us we haven't seen on film, we don't prepare for it and it shows on game day.  It's near impossible to prepare for every possible situation with the amount of plays we run.  

But it's a two edged sword. A defense can be totally unprepared for we plan on running that day.

Sorry for the rant but I think this is the main reason for our Oline woes. This unpreparedness will make them look slow an unathletic when they probably are quite the opposite.

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Posted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 11:52 am

Franks TanksView user's profile






Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 3273







edge29 wrote:
Franks Tanks wrote:


Generally speaking I like Mickey. I think some parts of his system are a bit questionable, such as sticking with the ride option although we don't seem to run it all that well. I do think that Mickey is a quality game planer and in game play caller. I do think Frank mucks up his play calls at times, and the periodic questionable play calls are not necessarily Mickey's fault.

We have to do better on the o-line. We've had talented and experienced players at several spots the last few years with continued poor results. It is becoming like our basketball team's continued lack of athleticism. We keep hoping for things to change, but all the same people stay in place and nothing does.


We've discussed this before and it does bring up a key point/challenge for Stan. We run a ton of different sets, a multitude of formations, player combos, and then plays off them. We run a lot of things on offense, but do we run any of them well? What is our bread and butter play on O? Anyone?

This is why I respect Colgate. You know what they're running, and you know what's coming at you. Now try and stop it.

We used to be this way when Hef. was o coordinator and Oline coach. When I played, we had FOUR running plays. FOUR! It's much easier to teach and learn four plays and every possible blitz/combo scenario off them than what we currently run. I believe it's another reason we have "no show" games. If a D throws something at us we haven't seen on film, we don't prepare for it and it shows on game day. It's near impossible to prepare for every possible situation with the amount of plays we run.

But it's a two edged sword. A defense can be totally unprepared for we plan on running that day.

Sorry for the rant but I think this is the main reason for our Oline woes. This unpreparedness will make them look slow an unathletic when they probably are quite the opposite.


Very good points. We have lacked an identity for some time.


As for the 4 running play....

24/25 zone

26/27 power

The toss, which was run pretty infrequently, and perhaps a draw for the 4th?

Really all you need. Aside from being a very good teacher and player developer, Heff understood the importance of being really good at a few things, namely blocking the inside zone, would produce tremendous results.

How often did he run the naked boot from the inside zone action? That play worked almost every time since the inside zone was such a strong and frequently used play.

I suppose you could make the argument that Stan is being given a nearly impossible job given our multiple formations ,plays and personnel groupings, which makes the D line up in many different looks. Not to write a novel here, but Stan, Mickey and Frank just don't seem to mesh.

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Posted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 12:19 pm

AndyView user's profile






Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 6047







Wasn't there a trap play that was bread and butter under Heff? Recall guys on this board criticizing its predictability. Definitely remember the naked boot with Maurer, very effective.  Interesting stuff from you guys on being too diverse.  We know Frank addressed that concept on D.

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Posted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 1:29 pm

Franks TanksView user's profile






Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 3273







Andy wrote:
Wasn't there a trap play that was bread and butter under Heff? Recall guys on this board criticizing its predictability. Definitely remember the naked boot with Maurer, very effective. Interesting stuff from you guys on being too diverse. We know Frank addressed that concept on D.


That was the "power" play. It was blocked like the below



The image isn't exactly right, but the general idea is there.

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Posted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 2:39 pm

flyfisherView user's profile






Joined: 11 Dec 2012
Posts: 1306







edge29 wrote:
Franks Tanks wrote:


Generally speaking I like Mickey. I think some parts of his system are a bit questionable, such as sticking with the ride option although we don't seem to run it all that well. I do think that Mickey is a quality game planer and in game play caller. I do think Frank mucks up his play calls at times, and the periodic questionable play calls are not necessarily Mickey's fault.

We have to do better on the o-line. We've had talented and experienced players at several spots the last few years with continued poor results. It is becoming like our basketball team's continued lack of athleticism. We keep hoping for things to change, but all the same people stay in place and nothing does.


We've discussed this before and it does bring up a key point/challenge for Stan. We run a ton of different sets, a multitude of formations, player combos, and then plays off them. We run a lot of things on offense, but do we run any of them well? What is our bread and butter play on O? Anyone?

This is why I respect Colgate. You know what they're running, and you know what's coming at you. Now try and stop it.

We used to be this way when Hef. was o coordinator and Oline coach. When I played, we had FOUR running plays. FOUR! It's much easier to teach and learn four plays and every possible blitz/combo scenario off them than what we currently run. I believe it's another reason we have "no show" games. If a D throws something at us we haven't seen on film, we don't prepare for it and it shows on game day. It's near impossible to prepare for every possible situation with the amount of plays we run.

But it's a two edged sword. A defense can be totally unprepared for we plan on running that day.

Sorry for the rant but I think this is the main reason for our Oline woes. This unpreparedness will make them look slow an unathletic when they probably are quite the opposite.


Edge29, you make some great points. A simpler playbook does help. that was my only issue with Loose's defense. You had to be a brainiac. 4 basic plays WITH VARIATIONS off each one does un-complicate things. However I can see some people here if we only had 4 running plays. they would kill Tavani.

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Posted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:04 pm

AndyView user's profile






Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 6047







Franks Tanks wrote:
Andy wrote:
Wasn't there a trap play that was bread and butter under Heff? Recall guys on this board criticizing its predictability. Definitely remember the naked boot with Maurer, very effective. Interesting stuff from you guys on being too diverse. We know Frank addressed that concept on D.


That was the "power" play. It was blocked like the below



The image isn't exactly right, but the general idea is there.


Yeah, do they still run that? I can't recall.

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Posted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:13 pm

Franks TanksView user's profile






Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 3273







Andy wrote:
Franks Tanks wrote:
Andy wrote:
Wasn't there a trap play that was bread and butter under Heff? Recall guys on this board criticizing its predictability. Definitely remember the naked boot with Maurer, very effective. Interesting stuff from you guys on being too diverse. We know Frank addressed that concept on D.


That was the "power" play. It was blocked like the below



The image isn't exactly right, but the general idea is there.


Yeah, do they still run that? I can't recall.


Not that I recall, but certainly possible as many teams run a variation of this play.

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Posted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:24 pm

edge29View user's profile






Joined: 20 Nov 2010
Posts: 756







flyfisher wrote:


Edge29, you make some great points. A simpler playbook does help. that was my only issue with Loose's defense. You had to be a brainiac. 4 basic plays WITH VARIATIONS off each one does un-complicate things. However I can see some people here if we only had 4 running plays. they would kill Tavani.


True.  Tavani needs a few 8/9 win seasons first.  But look at NDSU.  About as plain vanilla as can be.  Obviously they have the horses.  They do get creative at times and their predictablilty almost becomes an advantage in crucial downs.  I've seen them run plays that looked as though they were drawn in up in the dirt on the sideline.

Perhaps being able to recruit the athletes we want will help towards a more  consistent identity on offense.  We definitely seem to be getting kids in the same mold.

Agreed on the D.  I don't think we've given the credit that is due to Link .  Besides HC, our defense kept us in every game.

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Posted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 12:10 am

AndyView user's profile






Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 6047







Piece on Crossan:

http://www.sachemreport.com/2015/...san-commits-to-lafayette-college/

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Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 10:00 pm

NE LeopardView user's profile






Joined: 02 Sep 2014
Posts: 176







Pards welcome 2 WR's, 1 FB and 1 DE/LS today, Chenoweth, Eisler, Zeitler, Granjean,

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Posted: Tue Feb 24, 2015 5:11 pm

AndyView user's profile






Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 6047







NE Leopard wrote:
Pards welcome 2 WR's, 1 FB and 1 DE/LS today, Chenoweth, Eisler, Zeitler, Granjean,


Mr. GreenJeans can turn it on! Love that screen at :52!

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Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2015 3:18 pm

SIDELINERView user's profile






Joined: 13 Oct 2008
Posts: 655


Location: PA





12 days ago, seenalot wrote: "What do you want to bet that EXACT same run up the middle or perhaps the equally ineffective the ride option call isn't the FIRST play called for 2015.....?  Takers anyone?

I decided to see what was run on the first play of the 2014 season at Sacred Heart. Run up the middle? Ride option? Nope. A PASS!! Complete for 4 yards. Followed by false start penalty. Then ANOTHER PASS. Complete for 4 yards. Third down, ANOTHER PASS. Complete -- but for a five-yard loss. Fourth down, PUNT.

So, who could blame coaches if the first play against W&M in September was a run, but I'm going with a pass -- unless the drive starts deep in the hole.

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