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Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:35 am
TheTruth
Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 485
After a disappointing regular season, the Lady Leopards finished strong in the league tournament and played Lehigh even for 38 minutes. A few people acknowledged that Lehigh was clearly the best team in the league this year. We graduate 5 seniors and three starters (I believe) which tells me not to expect much improvement in our record next year. Unless there is more surprises on this team that we are not aware of. This was not suppose to be a re-building year. So where do we go from here?
What bothers me, carney2 pointed out this out, what did our coaches and players learn in the tournament that they somehow could not do the previous four months? It seems if played with the regular season with the same intensity as the tournament, maybe we could have been 7-7 or 8-6 in league play. Possibly a number 2 seed instead of scraping the bottom....again. 10 league losses in a row including a home loss to Colgate? Maybe our expectations were too high for this team?
Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 9:32 am
Lafalum
Joined: 06 Mar 2007
Posts: 843
I know I'm going to be villified for this but here goes. I'm not sure our athletes have understood what it takes to win at this level consistantly. I am not pointing at basketball in particular. Each of our teams this year have had their moments, the women's basketball team in the tournament.
We have had three winning teams this year so far and each couldn't put it together when they needed to.
Is it an indifference to their efforts by the campus? ( WE had a great turnout for the the women's championship...I have to believe that helped). Yes if they win they will come, but in the meantime we need , coaches and an athletic dept administration that knows how to raise and keep the support for these athletes, and athletes that are willing to put the extra sweat in when no one is looking. We have some athletes that clearly do that but not enough. Too many that are willing to let someone else do it!
Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 12:39 pm
The Maroon
Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 459
Location: Bethlehem, PA
TheTruth wrote:
After a disappointing regular season, the Lady Leopards finished strong in the league tournament and played Lehigh even for 38 minutes. A few people acknowledged that Lehigh was clearly the best team in the league this year. We graduate 5 seniors and three starters (I believe) which tells me not to expect much improvement in our record next year. Unless there is more surprises on this team that we are not aware of. This was not suppose to be a re-building year. So where do we go from here?
What bothers me, carney2 pointed out this out, what did our coaches and players learn in the tournament that they somehow could not do the previous four months? It seems if played with the regular season with the same intensity as the tournament, maybe we could have been 7-7 or 8-6 in league play. Possibly a number 2 seed instead of scraping the bottom....again. 10 league losses in a row including a home loss to Colgate? Maybe our expectations were too high for this team?
I'll be further vilified for this because the story of the league tournament is such a good one but this season was a disappointment and I, personally, don't think Tammy should be kept. I realize the mantra of every losing team is "all that matters is the Patriot League tournament" but some of us would like to see a little more of everything during the regular season. Particularly if the talent was there---as the tournament proves it was.
7 of 8 of Tammy's season this team has underachieved....I'd be happy to hear anybody make a case otherwise. Actually I'll argue it underachieved all 8.
Is the cupboard bare now? No---but I still don' t know how we're gonna get the ball up the court. Wright, McGorry, Serowoky and Virgin aren't a bad base to start with. Throw in Smith and we should have the best frontcourt we've had in years. Jackson and Downey are the two that need to move to the next level next season. Maybe we have a good frosh guard coming in--that would be nice. As Xbo's stats pointed out clearly, we got better when we stopped shooting outside as much - but I don't want to see a bunch of packed zones next season.
Next year we'll have 3.5 years of scholarships...Is it unreasonable to expect 1 .500 season in 9 years? _________________ I bleed Maroon
Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 1:30 pm
TheTruth
Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 485
To add to Lafalum's post, here's the standings for the President's Cup after the winter season: http://www.patriotleague.org/genrel/031709aad.html
I agree Maroon. I don't see this program going anywhere. It has been 9 years and it's time for a change.
I don't know what the College is looking to accomplish with our athletic program either. We are solidly in last place in the President's Cup so far. Obviously mediocrity is acceptable. the funny part is I've heard Art Rothkopf ask "why can't we compete for a President's Cup" Bucknell is there every year. We have as many resources as Bucknell yet we always finish 6th or 7th. Bucknell in the top 3.
Someone needs to look at why football, men's soccer and baseball seem to have had success while the other sports languish. Do these sports have better alumni support? Is the school not funding the other sports properly?
Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 1:48 pm
seenalot
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 305
No villification on either of the prior points. Team had a nice two game run at the end, and maybe they found out how to play to their talent - but over the past 7+ years Tammy's program has simply not gotten it done or shown consistent improvement, and given sr. graduations next year does not look better.
Its not likely to happen (not sure what Bruce's role is in that decision) but it should. What happened to the idea that we should compete for PL title at least once during a player's time at LC.
Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 2:25 pm
carney2
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 1174
I will make three points and then retire to the bar with a bourbon whilst I wait for Bruce et al. to do absolutely nothing:
1. Our recruiting is atrocious. The league is loaded with underclass talent, while our freshmen and sophomores, with the exception of Wright, are pretty average. We have no shooters and, as some seem to point out, our ball handling has the light and desirable touch of a blacksmith.
2. Game day decisions are not the best. We have complained frequently about rotations and the distribution of playing time. That weave and heave offense (thanks, KP) is a total mystery, especially when the "heave" has to come from someone who just cannot shoot (remember, we have no shooters).
3 Speaking of vilification, here is an item that I posted after the tournament final and for which I was vilified because of my timing. It is deserving of an airing, and I therefore throw it out there again - with some additions:
Why does the College community accept such mediocrity? And we do accept it. There is no accountability in the athletic department and, quite frankly, I cannot remember a time that it ever existed. Winning - no, let me rephrase that - excellence is a matter of luck and timing, and is usually a fleeting and unsustainable experience. You cannot point to a single sport where this has not been true. I will simply quote something that I heard once about Williams College and leave it at that: "If we accept mediocrity in anything, we accept mediocrity in everything."
Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 2:34 pm
Franks Tanks
Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 532
carney2 wrote:
I will make three points and then retire to the bar with a bourbon whilst I wait for Bruce et al. to do absolutely nothing:
1. Our recruiting is atrocious. The league is loaded with underclass talent, while our freshmen and sophomores, with the exception of Wright, are pretty average. We have no shooters and, as some seem to point out, our ball handling has the light and desirable touch of a blacksmith.
2. Game day decisions are not the best. We have complained frequently about rotations and the distribution of playing time. That weave and heave offense (thanks, KP) is a total mystery, especially when the "heave" has to come from someone who just cannot shoot (remember, we have no shooters).
3 Speaking of vilification, here is an item that I posted after the tournament final and for which I was vilified because of my timing. It is deserving of an airing, and I therefore throw it out there again - with some additions:
Why does the College community accept such mediocrity? And we do accept it. There is no accountability in the athletic department and, quite frankly, I cannot remember a time that it ever existed. Winning - no, let me rephrase that - excellence is a matter of luck and timing, and is usually a fleeting and unsustainable experience. You cannot point to a single sport where this has not been true. I will simply quote something that I heard once about Williams College and leave it at that: "If we accept mediocrity in anything, we accept mediocrity in everything."
Carney you are 100% correct. I actaully think our athletic department strives for medocrity, no only just accepts it.
This reminds me of the infamous article on Bill Russo upon hos retirement. In it Russo states that he was told upon his hiring to not win so much as to embarress the school. We are saddled with out of touch losers in positions of power.
Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 7:06 pm
Lafalum
Joined: 06 Mar 2007
Posts: 843
Franks Tanks wrote:
carney2 wrote:
Why does the College community accept such mediocrity? And we do accept it. There is no accountability in the athletic department and, quite frankly, I cannot remember a time that it ever existed. Winning - no, let me rephrase that - excellence is a matter of luck and timing, and is usually a fleeting and unsustainable experience. You cannot point to a single sport where this has not been true. I will simply quote something that I heard once about Williams College and leave it at that: "If we accept mediocrity in anything, we accept mediocrity in everything."
Carney you are 100% correct. I actaully think our athletic department strives for medocrity, no only just accepts it.
This reminds me of the infamous article on Bill Russo upon hos retirement. In it Russo states that he was told upon his hiring to not win so much as to embarress the school. We are saddled with out of touch losers in positions of power.
I had not seen that quote by Russo!! The acceptance of mediocrity starts with the BOT. I cannot think of one member of that Board that stands out for his or her leadership in their chosen field.
The administration is filled with followers and is constantly looking around their back for fear they'll be fired for not towing the party line.
The athletic adiministration has NEVER, NEVER had as its primary goal winning. I am quite frankly tired of the articles about some athlete's excel summer program at their local bank or their spring semester in Botswana. I want to win!!
Our approach is getting recruits who are more interested in that spring in Botswana than being part of a team that has as its mission to win that PL championship or more!!!
I am convinced that also gets us recruits who like to dabble in everything and excel in nothing!!
Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:30 pm
Franks Tanks
Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 532
Lafalum wrote:
Franks Tanks wrote:
carney2 wrote:
Why does the College community accept such mediocrity? And we do accept it. There is no accountability in the athletic department and, quite frankly, I cannot remember a time that it ever existed. Winning - no, let me rephrase that - excellence is a matter of luck and timing, and is usually a fleeting and unsustainable experience. You cannot point to a single sport where this has not been true. I will simply quote something that I heard once about Williams College and leave it at that: "If we accept mediocrity in anything, we accept mediocrity in everything."
Carney you are 100% correct. I actaully think our athletic department strives for medocrity, no only just accepts it.
This reminds me of the infamous article on Bill Russo upon hos retirement. In it Russo states that he was told upon his hiring to not win so much as to embarress the school. We are saddled with out of touch losers in positions of power.
I had not seen that quote by Russo!! The acceptance of mediocrity starts with the BOT. I cannot think of one member of that Board that stands out for his or her leadership in their chosen field.
The administration is filled with followers and is constantly looking around their back for fear they'll be fired for not towing the party line.
The athletic adiministration has NEVER, NEVER had as its primary goal winning. I am quite frankly tired of the articles about some athlete's excel summer program at their local bank or their spring semester in Botswana. I want to win!!
Our approach is getting recruits who are more interested in that spring in Botswana than being part of a team that has as its mission to win that PL championship or more!!!
I am convinced that also gets us recruits who like to dabble in everything and excel in nothing!!
I wish I could find the artcile. It was in the express times the day of the Lehigh game in 1999-- Russo's last game.
Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:44 pm
The Maroon
Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 459
Location: Bethlehem, PA
I believe the Russo quote has been reported in the newspapers. It certainly is pretty well known.
Regarding the culture of mediocrity...
I remember a conversation with professor DC Jackson (who I enjoyed immensely) after we got beat by Princeton in basketball. HE was "embarassed" it was as close as it was (it wasn't close...but the guy knew nothing about basketball). He said if we beat Princeton it means we are spending way too many of our resources on sports because Princeton is a much larger school. That was how he thought it should work--the bigger the school, the better the athletic program should be. Hence...we were small...We should almost never win.
I remember future provost June Schlueter (who I despised) saying she wanted it mandated that every student go abroad at least one interim period. When someone pointed out that our winter sports teams couldn't do that she asked "what are we here for? sports?!"
I remember being manager of the men's basketball team and telling a sociology professor I was going to miss class for a game...He couldn't undertand the difference between "manager" and "coach"...He really thought I was the coach...At least he only passed through Lafayette.
So yeah....there's some whack faculty at the school. There are some supporters though---the many faculty advisors come to mind.
OK...
I'll go to bat for the last two classes. I'll repeat the names I'm highest on....Virgin, Wright, Serowoky, McGorry...I'd take those four any day. And four better-than-average players in 2 classes is solid. Are they the best freshman/sophomore classes in the league? Probably not---but they are a big step up from what we used to have. But the void at guard is hard to overlook.
Hey...Maybe Downey, Jackson, Jenkins, Leone are going to step up next year and I will have mud in my eye...Wouldn't be the first time. Or maybe we have a phenom PG coming in. I just don't see how we can win many games next season without some VERY pleasant surprises at guard next year.
I know it's fodder for another thread, but the men's Lacrosse team hasn't had a winning season since 1984. I was big on blaming coach Lawson as a student...but obviously the problem is bigger than him.
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